Fate : Perspectives

A recent chat (8/8/2009 10:16:57 PM) on fate with a relative... excerpts from the transcript. Sorry for the typos. It might be a lil difficult to the eyes. some text has been masked for privacy.


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Me : yeah i heard about mit scholarships
Relative : let us see
Relative : apne takdir Me kya likha hai.....
Me : do u believe in fate?
Relative : s
Relative : ofcourse.......
Me : okk
Me : i have a different view.
Relative : hhhmmm
Relative : what is ur view abt it??
Me : i believe one can direct his/her future.
Me : and fate is nothing but a word given to the series of incidences one goes thru!
Relative : s i agree but u also need fate along with ur action.....
Relative : i agree first half not second half
Me : and both above are recursively implicit to each other
Me : whats your view onfate
Relative : according to Me action + fate = what ever is result
Me : no i Mean how do u see fate itself
Me : in other words how do u define the second paraMeter in the equation
Relative : soMe tiMes u do ur best but just that ur fate does not cooperate with u.....
Relative : u wont be able to find any faults in ur action.... but just that its ur fate
Relative : and mainly what i have seen in my life.....
Relative : i never thought i will be in [country*] in [industry*]......
Me : hmm ok.. i see it as the result of an action - a decision
Relative : i think tahts for last part... what abt first part
Me : hmm about the first part, to understand the situation it totally depends on th situation.. cant generalize it.
Relative : hhmmmm
Relative : thats true
Me : say for example, if u made a perfect painting for a competition and it doesnot win the first prize, there is no fault of yours in it
Relative : i think the way i end up in [industry*] is totally fate
Me : but the deciding fact or is a judge and probablty there was a better painter in his views
Relative : i had prepared for my cat exam nicely... and never thought abt getting into [industry*]....
Me : but the u did coMe arcoss the thought to join or not to join.. right?
Relative : but over night things turn around and i didnt had a choice but to coMe [country*] and drop my plan for mba
Relative : and with in 1 month tiMe i was in [country*]
Me : i understand.. but still view that situation as a decision made very quickly
Relative : u naMe it as decisition but i will say there was no other option....
Me : no other option?
Me : sorry i dint get it
Relative : and thats fate... that getting in [industry*] was in my fate
Relative : i didnt had any other choise
Me : well if i put myself in your shoe i see two options!
Relative : ?
Me : to go for it or not to go for it. the decision depends on the pros and cons!
Relative : pros and cons???
Me : i Mean what adv u have if u go and what if u not go.. then u need to make a judicious choice
Me : well there is a third option as well - toss lol
Relative :
Relative : i didnt had an option at that point of tiMe.....
Me : k. probably the situation demanded u to be there in [country*]
Relative : yap....
Me : but then u did analyse it right
Relative : nop... i didnt think anything else but just change my mind and worked on my passport and caMe [country*]
Me : okk.. toss lol
Me : toss with both sides head hehe
Relative :
Relative : one more scenario
Me : sure, i like to analyse and think on such discussions
Relative : soem tiMes a girl with good charrecter.... unfortunately get illtreated in their inlaws..... house ..... which is very common in india.....
Relative : so show Me how is her action can relate with her illtreatMent
Me : she gierl doesnt kow how the inlaws are when she coMes to the house
Relative : k
Me : the first experience she has of them should make her aware of the character of their inlaws
Relative : k
Me : she did not do any bad action
Me : it wsa her choice
Relative : k
Me : (or parent's choice incase of arranged marriages)
Relative : k
Relative : its arrange marriage
Me : it Means that the parents didnot access the in laws properly
Relative : s
Me : and neither did the girl
Me : i guess ppl interact before going in for a relation
Relative : k
Relative : not in all case......
Relative : and soMe tiMes they cant analyse it that well
Relative : their calculations may go wroung
Me : yes it happens.. but there is againa choice
Me : before the worse happens
Me : at anypoint of tiMe there will be choices
Relative : k
Me : the course of action on them creates what u call the fate
Relative : but soMe tiMes u dont have choice
Relative : s what they go through is what i call fate
Me : well not sure about that . nvr faced such a situation
Relative :
Me : i believe in this stateMent very firmly
Me : "Everything can be taken from a man but one thing:the last of the human freedoms to choose one's response in any circumstance, to choose one's own way. "
Relative : s
Me : Viktor Frankl's book Man's Search for Meaning
Relative : but soMe tiMes i do which u dont wish to but u dont hav a choise
Me : u do have a choice. but u choose the one which is the best
Relative : k
Relative : s
Me : if u can tell Me the situation u wereunder i can probably understand it better
Relative : soMe tiMes it may b best for situation but may not be a best .....in general
Relative : ok
Me : that right.. it may notbe teh best in the whle picture
Relative : i reMember 2 ex
Me : but good for that particulr part of the picture
Relative : a lady use to work in [*] hospital... not well educated but good in charecter......
Me : k
Relative : disregard...
Me : ??
Relative : a woMen was badly treated in her house she was locked in kitchen so she cant escape...... and she dont have an access to any communication......
Relative : she was kept in kitched naked.......
Me : why was she kept like that?
Me : bad family Members?
Relative : soMe part of country side ( i know in [state*] but dont know know abt different state)
Relative : s
Me : dowry case?
Relative : they dont want her to escape outside and complain abt her ill treatMent
Relative : could be.... but that not that girls fault
Me : right
Relative : so next example...
Relative : soMe part of country side ( i know in [state*] but dont know know abt different state)
Relative : they have a belief that
Relative : if it dosent rain ... then they make an unmarried woMen to go around that village naked......and no one is allowed to coMe out of their house at that tiMe....
Me : thats a superstition and the cause is illitercay
Relative : s
Me : there is law against it
Relative : yap i know.....
Relative : but wat is the bottom line....
Me : ??
Relative : its still happening...... and its not girls fault....
Me : well if the community she has beenliving in for years has been doig it
Me : she didnot take appropriate action agant it
Me : before
Relative : well she is illetrate she dint know
Relative : what to do
Me : in that case she has a choice
Me : to do it willingly or not to do it
Relative : she dont hav a choise....
Relative : parents and community pressure
Me : she has.. she cant be forced!
Me : at that level she needs to think what if she doesnt got for it
Relative : do u think any teen girl will do it happyly??
Me : no if it s the custom and they are open with it
Relative : i think i has to be above age
Me : they can opt to do it
Relative : mostly they wont but they dont have choise....
Me : if they really belive the rains coMe that way
Relative : coz soMe one has to do it... and usually they have turns.....
Relative : its happening in india dude
Me : the cause is iliteracy
Me : and the polition corruption
Relative : i totally agree
Me : if they kow their right no one will dare to
Me : force it on them
Relative : i belive that karma and fate are very much related..... taht is what [religion*] also says
Relative : well [religion*] says abt karma....
Me : well if u see fate in my definition its essentiall ythe saMe what u said now
Me : they both are recursively implicit to each other
Relative : s
Relative : both that not limit to ur action in this birth alone\
Me : not sure of other lives. one live is sufficient now in this current world lol
Me : life*
Relative : hahahaha
Me : its always science in action
Relative : hhmmm
Relative : i very much belive in karma and fate
Me : wel i also dont believe in rebirths concept
Relative : i dont have depth knowledge abt rebirth concept but i do have soMe basic knowledge....
Me : the concept of gods and idol worship was given by few selfish and self centerred ( soMetiMes science ppl!)
Me : who found ways to loot ppl
Relative : k
Me : this carried on as a belief
Me : and we actually see ppl worshipping elephants ' as an aMerican will say '
Relative :
Me : it totally boils down to the rational
Me : if the basis of the human judgeMent is biased, it cannot make a good judgeMent
Relative : hhhmmm
Me : if u want to really experience my views, u ned to always ask questions to yourself
Me : when u make decisions or commit any action
Relative : according to Me i dont have prob;lem going to temple (masjid, hindu/jain, or church) and worship......
Me : why, what, where, when how,
Relative : u dont have to donate or anything like that
Relative : i like to do it in action......
Relative : do right thing and make othere happy
Me : exactly
Me : afterall it your innerself which matters
Me : but the action should be unbiased
Relative : and if possible try to solve others probs.
Relative : but place and energy also matters
Relative : if u go to club and bar...... and observe ur thoughts...
Relative : and go to temple and observe ur thoughts....
Me : true.. isnt that a matter of self control??
Relative : no
Me : control on the chain of thoughs
Relative : s
Me : priority
Relative : but the energy around affects a lot....
Me : yes... agree to it
Me : but whenu say energy u talking about the self energy or the surring energy
Relative : soMe tiMes u go to temple and u feel good.... and you feel like Meditate............
Me : surrounding*
Relative : surrounding energy
Me : well i have an explanaation for that
Relative : and what u say abt selfcontrol i belive that is true.... but that is not for normal people.... thats one step above........
Relative : go ahead
Me : the normal daily life one leads is full of events and actions
Me : which may be in control of the person or which may control the person
Relative : k
Me : based on the cumulative effect of the factors on the person
Me : ther may be two distinct categories ofppl
Me : actually three
Me : the one who are incontrol
Me : th ones who get controlled
Me : and the ones who dont care.. they act when the situation demands
Relative : k
Me : the ones who are in control feel the sMe even when they are in hoMe
Me : or any other place
Relative : i agree
Me : the one who get controlled, they dont get to spend tiMe on themseles
Relative : but most of ppl r not in that catagory
Me : and hence feel theneed for a place when they can contemplate
Me : away from the factors affecting them daily
Me : hence temples
Relative : k
Me : the third ones dont give a heck to anything
Relative : do u belive in energy around.... ?
Me : they act when anything coMes up
Me : self energy yes
Relative : i m not talking abt self energy....
Me : nature?
Relative : i ma talking abt energy inside temple has + energy and energy inside bar hav kind of _ energy
Relative : s
Relative : nature
Me : sound?
Relative : no energy
Me : comparing the temple
Relative : vibration
Me : and the club
Relative : vibrationtemple is just an example
Relative : s
Me : the the environMent can be made similar but it wont be appealing
Me : a clunb is also a place to contemplate!
Me : its the chain of thoughts which matter finally
Relative : s
Me : donno what vibration temple is
Relative : there is a science behind that
Relative : [person*] will be right person to talk to u regarding atht coz he knows exactly in scintific language.....
Relative : Mera aur science ka badi duri hai
Me : o we had few rounds of chitchat on such topics when they were here in india
Me : intersting topics
Relative : but what exactly happens is actuallt
Relative : its all combination of ceMent and stone and sand.....
Relative : but how frequently the people goes there with + or - energy that coMes out of him and
Relative : get stuck in the walls
Relative : and has that vibration ..... of + or -
Relative : so when a person enters he will feel that vibratipon.....
Relative : this is for normal person....
Relative : there is one more... as u said selfcontrol......
Me : well need to visit that temple to know what exactly it Means
Relative :
Relative : ok buddy gotot go......
Relative : catch u later
Me : ok